Animal Rights

[bladespark]

I'm almost certainly preaching to the choir here, but if you support animal rights*, you should avoid PETA like the plague.

Here's a not entirely unbiased, but very fact laden account of the pet-dumping trial, which reveals that not only were PETA employees following SOP when they killed and dumped 31 animals, but that they'd dumped many more there, AND among the dead were a number of animals that were adoptable. Indeed that were given to PETA for the purpose of adoption, with said PETA employees assuring the former owners that the animals would find good homes.

It's a sad but very interesting read, and the worst bit is that the two killers, part of an organization that maintains that to kill an animal is equal to murdering a human, and that eating meat is comparable to being a prison guard during the holocaust, got away with their "murders" scott free, despite all the evidence to the contrary.



*I should probably say animal welfare, given how the two terms are used these days. But I don't know. I think animals should have rights. Not the kind of crazed "free from all human touch" rights that PETA wants to give them, but they should have the right to be free from pain, to avoid abuse. The be killed humanely and for a purpose if they are killed. They don't have rights in the way that humans have rights, but they do have rights all the same, or they should.

Comments

[harliquinnraver.livejournal.com]

oh man i heard about the original body dumping. i cannot BELIEVE that they got away with it! hell, by their own standards, they should be given the lethal injection.

[xianghua.livejournal.com]

It's also worth noting that what most people think of as 'animal rights' is really more championed by the animal WELFARE movement. Check out Naiaonline.org (I think that's the URL) for good info on the difference.

[bladespark.livejournal.com]

*nods* I'm fully in support of anything that genuinely helps animals. Particularly when it's something that's practical, that allows humans and animals to both benefit. Even if they weren't bloody hypocrites, that's the other problem I'd have with PETA, is their party line puts animals ahead of humans, and even if that's somehow high minded or morally superior (which I'm not sure it is!) it's just plain not practical. Humans are the dominant life form on this planet. For something to work it has to benefit humans too. Which taking care of animals and the environment and all that does in the long run! But trying to force us all to be vegetarians just... doesn't work. It's not a real solution, as nice as it might look on paper.

[xianghua.livejournal.com]

PETA is a psycho organization, and they advocate terrorism. They've funded the defense of a number of folks from the Animal Liberation Front. Here are some qoutes from PETA publications that tell you a LOT about their values:

The smallest form of life, even an ant or a clam, is equal to a human
being.
-Ingrid Newkirk, PETA

* * *

Six million Jews died in concentration camps, but six billion broiler
chickens will die this year in slaughter houses.
-Ingrid Newkirk (PETA)
(_Washington_Post_, Nov 13, 1983)

* * *

We feel animals have the same rights as a retarded human child.
-Alex Pacheco (PETA)
(_New_York_Times_, Jan 14, 1989)

Never buy wool again. Choose only cotton, synthetics and other non-animal
fibers. The sheep are embarrassed when they are shorn, sometimes they are
nicked during the process, and they get cold afterward.
(_PETA_News_, August 13, 1989)

* * *

Pet ownership is an "absolutely abysmal situation brought about by human
manipulation."
-Ingrid Newkirk, PETA
(_Washingtonian_Magazine_, August 1986)

The optimum human population of earth is zero.
-Dave Foreman, Earth First!

* * *

The human race could go extinct and I for one would not shed any tears.
-Dave Foreman, Earth First!

Even if animal tests produced a cure for AIDS, "We'd be against it."
-Ingrid Newkirk, PETA
(_Washington_Post_, May 30, 1989)

* * *

"Animal liberationists do not separate out the human animal, so there is
no rational basis for saying that a human being has special rights. A rat
is a pig is a dog is a boy. They're all mammals."
Ingrid Newkirk - Founder, PETA
As quoted in Vogue, September, 1989

* * *

"The life of an ant and the life of my child should be granted equal
consideration."
Michael Fox - Vice President, HSUS


"One day we would like an end to pet shops and the breeding of animals.
(Dogs) would pursue their natural lives in the wild...They would have full
lives, not waiting at home for someone to come home in the evening and pet
them and then sit there and watch TV."
Ingrid Newkirk - Founder, PETA
"Where Would We Be Without Animals?, Chicago Daily Herald, March 1, 1990

* * *

"...Eventually companion animals would be phased out, and we would return
to a more symbiotic relationship, enjoyment at a distance."
Ingrid Newkirk - Founder, PETA
Harpers, August, 1988

"We have no ethical obligation to preserve the different breeds of
livestock produced through selective breeding. ...One generation and out.
We have no problem with the extinction of domestic animals. They are
creations of human selective breeding."
Wayne Pacelle
Animal People May 1993 (Wayne Pacelle is the CURRENT president of the Humane Society of the US and the #1 reason I'm majorly against them as well- they used to be an animal welfare org, now they're crazy AR folks.)

In short? If you love your companion animals- ie dogs and cats and snakes and small fuzzies? PETA thinks you are a horrible person and your animals should die rather than be slaves and captives. That's the reasoning behind their shelter pull-and-kill tactic. When they used to support the ALF more actively (now they just pay for their defense lawyers), they would steal ('rescue') animals from research facilities and euthanize them becuase they were not able to survive in the wild- even animals which were not harmed in any way by research.

[bladespark.livejournal.com]

*nods* Yeah. You don't have to convince me of it, I know.

Sadly there are a lot of people who don't know, who think that PETA is about helping animals.

If it weren't so scary, some of those comments would be hilarious. Embarrassed naked sheep! *giggles*

[firebyrd.livejournal.com]

THANK YOU for including quotes from the HSUS. Most people don't realize that they and the ASPCA are as evil as PETA because they manage to be more subtle with their craziness. I'm ashamed that I donated to HSUS a few times, but because of that, I started getting their newsletters and realized the truth about them.

There *are* good humane organizations, though.

[xianghua.livejournal.com]

NAIA, American Humane Association, and best yet, your local shelters and rescue groups- especially those that are not able to be no kill.

Re: There *are* good humane organizations, though.

[firebyrd.livejournal.com]

Oh, absolutely. But the ones everyone seems to know about are PETA, HSUS, and the SPCA, and those aren't good. Both of my cats were adopted from local no-kill rescues, and as far as I'm aware, the local pounds are working really hard to reduce their kills. They do things like put pets up on their websites and put up flyers at local pet stores, so I'm fairly certain they're keeping them longer than the traditional three days.

I'm all for animal welfare, and I think it's very sad that the extremists have co-opted the term animal rights. It's kind of how you can't say you're a feminist without a good segment of the population thinking you're some sort of bra-burning, anti-man freak.

[kiwihunter8.livejournal.com]

I wonder if there's some kind of psychological term for the 'dualism' in thinking going on here. Extreme animals rights and then killing the animals.

Kind of like some religious folk can go to church and then do horrible things in their everyday lives without batting an eyelid.

[draggo.livejournal.com]

You really should see what Penn and Teller found when investigating PETA. There is more to it than what is posted here and it is much worse.

[svashtar.livejournal.com]

PeTA also is a known supporter of the terrorist organization ALF (Animal Liberation Front).

Been saying for years that PeTA is run by a bunch of hypocrites. I hate every last one of them and would gladly eat furry cute animals in front of them just to piss them off.

They make me want to kill kittens. I am not kidding.
And I love kittens.

But that is how angry they make me.

[svashtar.livejournal.com]

In fact, when I was still working with a Vegan PeTA supporter (we got into some vicious arguments), I took to wearing my "Vegetarian is an old Indian word meaning Bad Hunter" teeshirt in front of her.

[firebyrd.livejournal.com]

My husband and I have recently been very amused by the billboards Ruby River Steakhouse that say, "Converting vegetarians one steak at at time."

[emirasan.livejournal.com]

People who work for and believe that what PETA does is good should be euthanized in a not humane way.

Embarrassed sheep...*shakes head* that is too freaking funny.

[firebyrd.livejournal.com]

Especially when you consider they're shorn in the summer, and my understanding has always been that it's /nice/ for them once it's done. Who wants to be running around in several inches worth of wool in the middle of summer? They get cold my rear end.

[emirasan.livejournal.com]

That and the clippers that are used make it difficult if not downright impossible for someone to nick their skin. I've seen sheep shearing demo's at fairs in the late summer. They looked a lot happier and a lot more comfortable after getting all that wool off.

[firebyrd.livejournal.com]

I believe it. I mean, back in the day when people were just using razor blades, expert shearers rarely if ever nicked them. With our electric razors with skin guards, it would be very difficult to do.

[sparkindarkness.livejournal.com]

PETA annoys me so much. I sometimes think they're made up by groups trying to discredit animal rights because they couldn't do a better job of it if they tried.

There is no easier way to kill a cause than have the truly crazy support it

[wolfmare.livejournal.com]

"...Eventually companion animals would be phased out, and we would return
to a more symbiotic relationship, enjoyment at a distance."

Um... Yeah. Symbiotic means that both organisms gain something from the relationship. So, somebody explain to me, what would an animal be gaining from somebody watching it? That tends to make them more paranoid then being handled ever could.



I've been against PETA since I heard of them. If they truly think the world would be better with no humans, I say it should be legal to prove them partially right and get them off the planet first. Preferably with explosives. Lots of explosives.


As far as 'animal rights', I think animals have the right to live peacefully and be taken care of, and if their role is to be food, to be killed as humanely as we can manage within reason. And not to have complete idiots speaking in their defense.

[chalcy.livejournal.com]

In terms of domestic animals (generally farm animals), animal welfare is usually described by the five freedoms:

-Freedom from hunger and thirst
-Freedom from pain, injury or disease
-Freedom from fear and distress
-Freedom from discomfort
-Freedom to express most normal behaviours.

IMO, this means that captive animals are generally better off than their wild counterparts, assuming these guidelines are followed. Though there are cases where that's debatable (eg battery hens).

(Sorry, been meaning to post this comment for a couple of days).

[bladespark.livejournal.com]

*nods* I think the problem is that once you get past the first couple there, it's really hard to pin down exactly what is good husbandry and what isn't. Animals in captivity behave differently than in the wild, and even further, domesticated strains have behavior sets that would probably get them killed out in nature. And until we get animal telepaths out there to tell us what they really want, it's hard to know if sitting around in a situation where a human would be bored silly but which otherwise isn't cruel (I'm thinking of the hens in question) is really bothering the animal any. The only way to judge is to watch behavior, and honestly that's all subjective. I can say that yes, this creature appears stressed, but can I really prove it?

I mean... I'm all for trying to make animals, even food animals, healthy and happy, but most of the arguments I've seen are based on fluff, not facts. They make claims about how miserable animals are, but those claims all too often are phrased in a "well how would YOU like to be shut up in a tiny cage all the time?" Well, I wouldn't like it much, but I'm not a chicken. I'd get bored. Do chickens get bored? Or are they happy to just be lazy butts so long as they're fed?

[chalcy.livejournal.com]

Yeah... that's pretty much what we debated in class. Trying to test animal behaviour preferences gets really interesting. Tends to involve things like giving chickens the choice between different floor types to see which one they choose (apparently chickens prefer a small cage with a grass floor over a large one with a wire floor).

You can measure stress hormones levels, which at least gives you a quantitative measurement. But then you get into debates as to whether or not a behavioural need can be expressed independently of a physiological one (in my opinion you can't, but my reading on the subject isn't exactly in depth).

It's an interesting subject to study, but debates tend to go round in circles and depend greatly on your own personal view point.